We have change the way we accept donations towards the community, we are now using Patreon.
Visit our link at https://www.patreon.com/GamingAlliance and donate and get some extra benefits while you are at it :)
PlayARK Australia is not run for profit and all donations goes towards this community.

New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Got a question ? or a suggestion about our site or server? post it here :)
Ragnarok
Veteran
Posts: 170
Tribe: Gypsy Vikings
Status: Offline

New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#1 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:13 pm

With how Ark have been altering what can and can't be done, eg no more ptera bombs, turrets shoot c4 first, every soaking dinos saddles being nerfed down to pathetic numbers. This is making raiding harder and harder. Online raiding is already 10 times harder than offline, you have to be far more on the fly regarding what decisions to make, you face rockets and sniper bullets coming at you while soaking, either way taking the hill is far harder than defending it. The only reason at all that larger tribes are able to be online raided is because the raiders can have a secure location to raid from, aka a raid base with a lot of turrets. This new rule "A raid base (created for the purpose of raiding and respawning, is covered under the outpost rules, except these bases can have up to 4 turrets on or near the base and must not be excessively large, these outposts MUST be removed once raiding is complete/abandoned (must be removed before you leave the area)" completely destroys this possibility at all. A raid base keeps your raid dinos safe, your spare flack, rockets, c4 etc... But four turrets are absolutely nothing to get through, get one person on a quetz with turtle soaking them, while another runs up in decent flack and shoots a rocket at them, 4 good rockets and those turrets are gone. Munki you have said to me yourself the turrets don't keep up with the tech in this game, and the only way to make an even remotely secure base is a high concentration of turrets so why are raid bases any different.

User avatar
DrunkMunki
Server Admin
Posts: 1087
Tribe: Admin
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#2 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:26 pm

What do you suggest then?

- People defending have limited ability to retaliate, rockets (too slow), sniper rifle, too hard to hit something, all they can use are dinos and stealth, all the while trying to avoid your shots and capture.
the only thing that slows people raiding a base are turrets ... species x are taken care of easily with a rocket launcher and once the turrets ammo is gone, then what?.
- Raiders have; rocket launchers, C4, dinos with massive HP, sniper rifles...

the tribe being "online" raided is more concerned about preventing you access then finding your base and rocketing it ... as you would have your dinos there, spawning from the base regularly, could easily grab one of them if the come near, and make them a hostage.. severely limiting the defenders...

the turret rule is to stop people putting 100 turrets around their "raid base" pretty much preventing ANY retaliation ... therefore online raiding becomes, raiding with a little bit of pvp.

i am open to suggestions, perhaps increase it to 6 .. but with the S+ turrets they no longer need electricity, have a lot of ammo and can shoot rockets and if you see your turrets being drained, then u fly up and grab them ...

i would like peoples thoughts ... keep in mind there is no shame in offline raiding, not like anyone would choose when they get robbed, but it is a survival game.

Additionally: only about 5% of players actually online raid, everything else is done offline

one could also say that offline raiding is more beneficial... if you online raid someone they can easily despawn all their stuff and then you would have nothing to get in return, wasting your resources.
For emergencies such as server going down email: drunkmunki[at]gamingalliance.net

Ragnarok
Veteran
Posts: 170
Tribe: Gypsy Vikings
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#3 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:53 pm

DrunkMunki wrote:What do you suggest then?

People learn to play the game fast, Chucky and I have been on the center probably 2 weeks, I would say we personally already have the alpha base, granted we play a lot but we also mess around a lot, if we focused more we would be far further along than we allready are, which is very far.

DrunkMunki wrote:- People defending have limited ability to retaliate, rockets (too slow), sniper rifle, too hard to hit something, all they can use are dinos and stealth, all the while trying to avoid your shots and capture.
the only thing that slows people raiding a base are turrets ... species x are taken care of easily with a rocket launcher and once the turrets ammo is gone, then what?.
- Raiders have; rocket launchers, C4, dinos with massive HP, sniper rifles...
I disagree, people defending have all the advantage, they have access to all of their crafting stations, access to every Dino they need/own, unlimited respawns. Again if people have actually been playing their base should be a fortress after a month let alone some of the people that have been on for months on the center and their base is frankly a joke for a pvp server. If they want to play pve style then go for it but this server has pvp in the name.
DrunkMunki wrote:the tribe being "online" raided is more concerned about preventing you access then finding your base and rocketing it ... as you would have your dinos there, spawning from the base regularly, could easily grab one of them if the come near, and make them a hostage.. severely limiting the defenders...
They are and the best way to prevent that is huge turret density. But if Chucky and I were being online raided right now and the raid base the people set up only had 4 turrets you can bet your bottom dollar that we would be looking for that raid base, we blow it up and the raid is over, we would have destroyed their safety, gotten their supplies etc...

DrunkMunki wrote:the turret rule is to stop people putting 100 turrets around their "raid base" pretty much preventing ANY retaliation ... therefore online raiding becomes, raiding with a little bit of pvp.
Our base on the center has probably 200ish turrets after 2 weeks, coming from multiple turrets towers. It would be a near impossible raid to begin with let alone people trying to raid it while only having a raid base with 4 turrets on it.
DrunkMunki wrote:i am open to suggestions, perhaps increase it to 6 .. but with the S+ turrets they no longer need electricity, have a lot of ammo and can shoot rockets and if you see your turrets being drained, then u fly up and grab them ...
Turrets are only good when they have density, if you have someone soaking them from a different angle, while someone has 1000 plus armour, decent health and decent speed with some focal chili there is nothing 4 turrets can do to stop you blowing them up. I have 124 movement speed on the center, 10 turrets didn't stop me suicide bombing mcguilds turret tower this weekend that had 4 turrets on it plus getting shot by another 6 or so from the base. The defenders may not get it on the first try, but if they know what they are doing they will destroy those turrets in a reasonable amount of attempts.
DrunkMunki wrote:i would like peoples thoughts ... keep in mind there is no shame in offline raiding, not like anyone would choose when they get robbed, but it is a survival game.
I don't know what the magic number is, but I would say anything less than 20 turrets is far far far too low. You may have seen on rickys base while we were raiding it what his 4 turrets were doing to us and saw it took a while to get in, but there's a very specific reason for that, they could only be soaked one way through the entrance of the cave as we were funneled into them, once those were gone we easily managed to get rid of the other turrets in the cave because we had a range of directions, on a raid base this is way easier as you literally have a dome to soak in any direction if you have a quetz, this makes sneaking up with a rocket launcher very easy.

User avatar
El_Jefe
Dino Tamer
Posts: 25
Tribe: CNA
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#4 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 11:04 pm

To me it is less about the individual rule change, and more about the combination of new rules allowing more aggressive tribes to 'wipe' a player within the rules. 4 hours to raid is understandable, and vaults/storage/crafting stations as collateral is also understandable (if locked). I do not like the change to platform dinos as outposts. Any tribe can now blow into a base, blow vaults and benches etc even if unlocked as the rules state all these stations are now free game. If this is done offline, any moderately skilled tribe with more than 3 members should break into most bases within 1-2 hours. They can then blow up any platform dinos with intent to kill, under the excuse of 'looting'. Once all of this is done, the well prepared attacking tribe can spend the remaining time tranqing all dinos and stealing any remaining items of even remote value (prim saddles, hide/fibre, its all legal to take) and blowing as many turrets as time permits to steal the ammo. Once this has concluded, the same tribe can legally destroy all their victims outposts from around the map, right to the foundation (although this was always allowed). As I said, I don't necessarily object to some of the changes, however to a griefer these rules present a prime opportunity to exploit the system at the cost of the majority of their victims possessions and even dinos.

User avatar
DrunkMunki
Server Admin
Posts: 1087
Tribe: Admin
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#5 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:48 am

From what i see, only the alpha tribes raid ... so technically why would they need to raid in the first place when they have everything? cause isnt the purpose of a raid to get resources, so u can expand your base?

The defenders at the end of it will loose everything, unless a raider comes unprepared, all they have to do is get past the turrets then everything is available to the raiders ... but a raiding base you only loose what you brought.

turret wise, i don't believe there should be a massive amount for a remote base, where there's no chance for the defender to remove the threat if the base has like 100 turrets, all they can do is wait it out, or give up, so i have raised the limit to 8 but wont go higher than that.

I agree with El Jefe, i have removed the rule for killing dinos with bases on them, instead specified c4 to be used

i have also clarified destruction of S+ benches only.. main rule is i keep having people put in reports this player blew up my smithy ... the purpose of the rules is to protect the majority of your base and your dinos, not to squabble about easily replaced items such as a workbench. if you use S+ tools, then you take the risk of having them blown up .. again i have clarified these can be blown up by c4 only.
For emergencies such as server going down email: drunkmunki[at]gamingalliance.net

Ragnarok
Veteran
Posts: 170
Tribe: Gypsy Vikings
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#6 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 8:54 am

DrunkMunki wrote:From what i see, only the alpha tribes raid ... so technically why would they need to raid in the first place when they have everything? cause isnt the purpose of a raid to get resources, so u can expand your base?

The defenders at the end of it will loose everything, unless a raider comes unprepared, all they have to do is get past the turrets then everything is available to the raiders ... but a raiding base you only loose what you brought.

turret wise, i don't believe there should be a massive amount for a remote base, where there's no chance for the defender to remove the threat if the base has like 100 turrets, all they can do is wait it out, or give up, so i have raised the limit to 8 but wont go higher than that.

Personally I don't raid for resources, if I get some that's great but raiding is a good challenge about getting into someones base with turrets. We know all the efficient methods to get resources in the game so it would be far more efficient for me to farm my own resources than to raid for them. Defenders could lose everything, but the raiders could also lose 20 plus sets of good flak, a couple of hundred c4 and rockets as well as multiple launchers as well as reputation.
You said there's nothing wrong with offline raiding which I agree with, there are bases I wouldn't attempt online at all because it would make it near on impossible especially with only a couple of raiders, however there is a time for online raids and they are a lot of fun.

I still personally don't believe 8 turrets is enough for a raid base, however it is far far better than 4 so thank you for upping it.

User avatar
King_Kiff
Ultimate Survivor
Posts: 255
Tribe: All Aussie Adventures
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#7 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:29 pm

This thread is funny.

After a weekend of successful raiding you are saying raiding is to hard?

I would argue the exact opposite to everything you have said. Raiders have a very distinct advantage to the defender whom is usually offline anyway. Everything you say about defenders being able to drain your turrets ect. can be applied in the reverse. Catch em and cage em like you did with my brother Rick, it works just fine.

I would personally like to see the rule changed that you can only have so many lives per raid, say 5. The idea of constant re spawning and suicide running sucks to me. I feel a real raider should try to stay alive at all costs. Who needs tanking turtles when I can just spawn over and over running naked at your turrets? It how Chinese Zerg tribes get a foot hold on officials with no resources what so ever before setting up and transferring in.

As for you base being un-raidable. No. Given enough prep time and doing it while your offline anything is possible with unlimited lives. Plus breeding turtles is easy as. I've been banned for a bit now and some of my turtles my brother has showed me are well over 30k health now, couple that with a decent saddle and it tanks almost endlessly... Breed a few of those together and even the most well stocked S+ turret runs dry.

I'll say again. Raiders always have the advantage and I would like to see the rules adjusted to make it slightly harder for them whilst doing so.

Ragnarok
Veteran
Posts: 170
Tribe: Gypsy Vikings
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#8 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:22 pm

King_Kiff wrote:This thread is funny.

After a weekend of successful raiding you are saying raiding is to hard?

I would argue the exact opposite to everything you have said. Raiders have a very distinct advantage to the defender whom is usually offline anyway. Everything you say about defenders being able to drain your turrets ect. can be applied in the reverse. Catch em and cage em like you did with my brother Rick, it works just fine.

I would personally like to see the rule changed that you can only have so many lives per raid, say 5. The idea of constant re spawning and suicide running sucks to me. I feel a real raider should try to stay alive at all costs. Who needs tanking turtles when I can just spawn over and over running naked at your turrets? It how Chinese Zerg tribes get a foot hold on officials with no resources what so ever before setting up and transferring in.

As for you base being un-raidable. No. Given enough prep time and doing it while your offline anything is possible with unlimited lives. Plus breeding turtles is easy as. I've been banned for a bit now and some of my turtles my brother has showed me are well over 30k health now, couple that with a decent saddle and it tanks almost endlessly... Breed a few of those together and even the most well stocked S+ turret runs dry.

I'll say again. Raiders always have the advantage and I would like to see the rules adjusted to make it slightly harder for them whilst doing so.
Ark is making raiding harder and harder, the only reason we had a successful weekend is your brother and mcguild set their bases out wrong. I also said my base was "a near impossible raid" which given munkis rules and if you have ever seen our cave you would hopefully understand why, good luck with your turtles down there. If you do however get in we will redesign our base it's that simple, it's not an issue to us if someone blows in and steals our stuff we can always get more. I hope I see you outside my base gates when you become unbanned.

User avatar
King_Kiff
Ultimate Survivor
Posts: 255
Tribe: All Aussie Adventures
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#9 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 2:33 pm

Ragnarok wrote:
King_Kiff wrote:This thread is funny.

After a weekend of successful raiding you are saying raiding is to hard?

I would argue the exact opposite to everything you have said. Raiders have a very distinct advantage to the defender whom is usually offline anyway. Everything you say about defenders being able to drain your turrets ect. can be applied in the reverse. Catch em and cage em like you did with my brother Rick, it works just fine.

I would personally like to see the rule changed that you can only have so many lives per raid, say 5. The idea of constant re spawning and suicide running sucks to me. I feel a real raider should try to stay alive at all costs. Who needs tanking turtles when I can just spawn over and over running naked at your turrets? It how Chinese Zerg tribes get a foot hold on officials with no resources what so ever before setting up and transferring in.

As for you base being un-raidable. No. Given enough prep time and doing it while your offline anything is possible with unlimited lives. Plus breeding turtles is easy as. I've been banned for a bit now and some of my turtles my brother has showed me are well over 30k health now, couple that with a decent saddle and it tanks almost endlessly... Breed a few of those together and even the most well stocked S+ turret runs dry.

I'll say again. Raiders always have the advantage and I would like to see the rules adjusted to make it slightly harder for them whilst doing so.
Ark is making raiding harder and harder, the only reason we had a successful weekend is your brother and mcguild set their bases out wrong. I also said my base was "a near impossible raid" which given munkis rules and if you have ever seen our cave you would hopefully understand why, good luck with your turtles down there. If you do however get in we will redesign our base it's that simple, it's not an issue to us if someone blows in and steals our stuff we can always get more. I hope I see you outside my base gates when you become unbanned.

lol it wasn't a threat it was just an observation :)

Stick
Veteran
Posts: 111
Tribe: Powerpuff Boys
Status: Offline

Re: New rules have just destroyed online raiding

Post#10 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:25 pm

Seeing as c4 is now promoted as the weapon of choice for both destruction of smithy's and raiding in general could I please recommend that you increase the damage of c4.

Currently c4 do about 703 damage compared to the already nerfed damage of a rocket of 1,000.

To incentavise the use of c4 could you please increase its damage to atleast match that of what a rocket does? The way I see it is why would I spend more on resources to do less damage.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest